Before I move on to the controversial issues in this post, here are the links to the other posts in this series.
- Which Essential Oils Company is Best? – Part 1
– Best Essential Oils -What a Good Oils Company Should Have – Part 2
- Which Essential Oils Company is Best – Troubles with the Oils Industry – Part 3
– Young Living vs. doTERRA – Part 4
- Are Multi-Level Marketing Oils Worth It? – Part 5
- Announcing “the Best” Essential Oils Company – Part 7 **
**Attention** – Some readers say that they can’t access the Part 7. If that is a problem for you, could I ask you to comment or email me at wholenewmom{at} gmail {dot} com, and you can go to this post to get access to the company that I chose. Is Essential Oils Testing Reliable?
Now, back to the controversy.
I am typically not a fan of sensationalist titles for posts, but in this case, I kind of couldn't resist.
First of all, I need to apologize that I am going to have to push out the "announcement" day of the Best Essential Oils Series--just one more day.
Why? Let me explain.
I really didn't want to do this, but I felt that with all the controversy going on regarding my review process that I should take time to address more issues that have come up during this series. I want you to know that I am doing my homework and that I take what I am doing very seriously.
If you've been following along with the whole Best Essential Oils series, and have read the comments, you've seen that there have been a number of statements made, mostly by Dr. Robert Pappas. What you may not know is that he has been commenting about my posts, and my blog, on his Facebook page, and has private messaged me on Facebook a number of times.
I've had a load of stuff on my plate these past few weeks (meh--still do), so it has taken me awhile to do enough research into some of his more scientific statements so that I could respond intelligently.
Today I am going to do so. Because of the subject matter, this is going to be a much more lengthy post than usual, but I really thought it all needed to be addressed.
1. Source of Information
Pappas has insinuated, or directly asserted, that some of my statements with which he disagrees originated with Young Living (YL). That is completely not true. Here is one of his quotes from the comments on Part 4 of the Best Essential Oils Series:
Hi, just wanted to clear up some things concerning your comments about 1st, 2nd, 3rd distillations because this is an area of misinformation that, as far as I can tell, originates from the YL reps going back quite a number of years and just never seems to die down.
Yes, I was a Young Living rep, but interestingly enough, the information that I got about these distillations of peppermint came from doTERRA's support. You can see this in the next section about distillation.
2. Distillation of oils -1st, 2nd, 3rd and Complete
At the center of a lot of the controversy regarding my oils series is the distillation methods of oils, particularly peppermint.
I stated in Part 4 that doTERRA's peppermint oil was a "complete distill." Here is Pappas response from the comments:
"Who was it that told you their oil was “complete”? The word “complete” is not even a word that anyone in the essential oil industry would even use to describe a peppermint oil. Complete is used to describe a grade of Ylang Ylang oil and thats [sic] about it. Generally the best therapeutic oils also smell the best, at least thats [sic] been my experience."
Here is an excerpt from the email that I received from the assistant to Dr. Hill, Chief Medical Advisor for doTERRA. Please note that she both uses the word "complete" and also discusses the 3 distillation stages to describe doTERRA's peppermint.
Please apologize to her [Adrienne], I'm not sure why she didn't receive the
response. You can let her know that our Peppermint uses complete
distillation. There is 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and complete and we use complete.I hope this is helpful!
Thanks,
--
Haylee Caplin
doTERRA Product Support
Pappas also commented:
Anyway, regarding peppermint (and essential oils in general for that matter), there typically is no such concept as a 1st, 2nd or 3rd distillation.
and then later in a comment that I hadn't approved until now (because I wanted to do more research before putting the information out there):
As for your question about the “1st distillation” I am guessing you might not have read my post completely about this or perhaps you just don’t believe me but this term is NEVER used in the industry and I would strongly recommend that you not use it either because its [sic] a misleading term. There is typically only ONE steam distillation of an oil to remove the oil from its plant material. When people say 1st distillation or 2nd distillation it conjures up images of redistilling the already spent botanical to get a less inferior oil. Nobody does this.
Well, this is a lot of info to digest, but here goes.
First of all, there are a host of references to these 1st, 2nd, and 3rd distillations that I found.
References to 1st, 2nd, and 3rd Distillations from Oils Companies
These are references to this kind of distillation that I easily found doing an internet search:
1. "Even an oil which is quite truthfully described as pure may be of poor quality, and therefore of less value therapeutically. IF AN ESSENTIAL OIL COSTS MUCH LESS THAN YOU WOULD NORMALLY EXPECT TO PAY FOR IT, the oil may well be a third or fourth distillate from a batch of plant material which has already yielded the greater part of its properties to the first or second distillation." Aromatherapy An A-Z, by Patricia Davis, 1988, reprinted 1994, Saffron Walden, The C.W. Daniel Company Ltd., England, pp. 278-280.
2. "LOW PRICES MAY ALSO MEAN THE OIL IS A SECOND OR THIRD DISTILLATION OF THE PLANT MATERIAL, in which case it will have far less therapeutic value." - from Holistic Aromatherapy, A. Berwick, 1994, Llewellyn Pub., St. Paul, MN pp. 168.
3. Brambleberry.com sells different distillations of peppermint oils. From their site: Peppermint Essential Oil (1st distillation): This is an herbaceous, sweet smelling peppermint. It is less brisk smelling than the 2nd distillation and contains slightly less menthol
4. From Mountain Rose Herbs' website: "All of the oils offered by Mountain Rose Herbs are derived from the first distillation--never the second, third or fourth!"
5. From The Herbs Place: "Oil comes from the first distillations of the raw plant material." when referring to why their oils are therapeutic grade.
I spoke with several people in the EO field and this is what I heard (of course, given the scope of this post, this is a summary only).
1. Most plants are distilled only once because they don't produce enough oil for multiple distillations.
2. Peppermint is an interesting plant in that it yields more oil than most others. As such, large farms and distilleries extract a bunch of oil from the peppermint plant
Smaller farms do a first distillation of peppermint that they sell to oils companies for the highest price.
The peppermint is then re-distilled at a higher pressure and higher temperature for a 2nd distill, and the resulting oil is sold for less money to soap companies, and the like, that want a lower cost oil, but still desire a slightly "herby" smell.
The plant is then re-distilled one more time at a yet higher temperature and pressure for a 3rd distill, which is sold to companies wanting the candy-cane smelling oil.
Pappas has a lot of knowledge about essential oils that I don't have, but there are a lot of people using these terms in the industry, including those at doTERRA. So it's clearly a very complicated matter that people have different opinions (including professional opinions) about.
UPDATE 8/16:
As you can probably tell, this distillation issue is very complicated.
Since this series was published, I was given more information from other experts (a distiller and chemists) in the field stating the following about essential oils and the distillation process:
However it is possible to distill one charge of plant using different configurations. The [sic} distiller ... could be, for example, performing an atmospheric pressure distillation of the plant for 10 minutes, then increasing the pressure for another period and so on. As long as there is still essential oil in the plant matter this is possible. The more volatile and nice smelling aromatics will be trapped within the first "phase" of an operation like this and subsequent processing will extract higher boiling point components; as the distillation progresses, the compounds will become less desirable, therefore cheaper.
Basically, it's a very confusing issue as to why some peppermint oils smell ultra sweet and others do not. Perhaps something is being taken out of the oil after distilling. In the case of oils that are not pure, something may be added in. There might be some peppermint oils that are referred to as this "first distillation" that are being sold as being therapeutically superior, but that would be a subjective decision and likely most aromatherapists would want all of the components of the oil, except in the case of ylang ylang (see the following information).
The basic thing to keep in mind through all of this is that you want to purchase your essential oils from a company that you trust to sell only quality, pure, unadulterated oils from indigenous locations.
3. Ylang Ylang is an exception to this rule. It is distilled first for a short time, yielding the most coveted "ylang ylang extra." The distiller is shut down, the oil collected, and then it is distilled further to produce "ylang ylang 1." (UPDATE: I just heard that most distillers don't shut down the distiller, but merely change out the containers to keep the oil grades separate and continue distilling.) This continues to subsequently produce "ylang ylang 2" and "ylang ylang 3." Then, all 4 varieties of ylang ylang are combined to make "ylang ylang complete," which is preferred by some, but is priced lower than "ylang ylang extra."
3. Bias and Motivation
On his Facebook page, Pappas and his followers have talked about what my motives are:
Perhaps it will all be clear on Tuesday when she makes her great reveal....I can't help but question the motives here.
There were also numerous statements by Pappas that his company doesn't sell oils, but that he is merely an unbiased chemist who educates and tests oils for various companies.
He is the man who tests oils for doTERRA. That means he is inherently biased. doTERRA pays him to authenticate the quality of their oils so, I don't see how it could be that he doesn't have an interest in their oils being represented as being superior.
If doTERRA does well, Pappas does well. At least on some level.
Again, as for my bias, it is for finding an oils company with the best qualities that I can find, at the best price.
Nothing more. If the company that I recommend ends up having ethical or quality issues, then I won't recommend them anymore. Plain and simple.
There are loads of money-making opportunities that I have passed up because I can't, in good conscience, take them. I have blocked the URL's of companies whose ads I disapprove of, all which have led to less income for me.
One other point that I am a little confused about: Pappas has said over and over again that he is very concerned that I am putting out wrong information about the oils. I am a lover of information as well, so I appreciate that.
However, in one of his comments to me, regarding my questioning why Emily Wright and David Hill are spreading apparently incorrect information about their peppermint oil, his reply was:
What they say in their marketing is not something I concern myself with with, just as its not my concern what any other company who sends me samples for analysis does with their marketing descriptions.
I don't understand why Pappas thinks it's crucial to correct apparent misinformation that comes from me, but not misinformation that comes from what is likely his main employment source, and one of the biggest sources of EO information in the U.S.
4. Vomit and Peppermint Oil
Sorry for the sensationalist title here.
In the comments section of Part 4 of the series, Pappas states:
The thing about peppermint oil is that when its [sic] freshly distilled it contains very tiny amounts of some sulfurous components as well as some small aldehydes (namely isomers of isovaleraldehyde, also found in vomit) that, while minuscule in percentage, are such powerful components that you can smell them at ppm levels. The effects of these components can be minimized with age and evaporation because they are very volatile, but another way to get rid of these undesirables is to take the crude freshly distilled oil and then use a different distillation setup to fractionally vacuum distill away this tiny amount oil, thus giving the remaining oil a much better flavor, sweeter aroma...
Well, again, I am not an expert here, but I looked up isovaleraldehyde and vomit and there were no mentions of isovaleraldehyde being in vomit. The only connections between the two seem to be that exposure to isovaleraldehydes can lead to vomiting. I would need to see sources for this information because I couldn't find any. In fact the main (almost all) results of my search were only Pappas stating this on my blog and on various Facebook pages.
Additionally, even if isomers of isovaleraldehyde are in vomit, that does not make them problematic. For example, water and stomach acid are in vomit and so is food. I drink water and eat food daily and I even take stomach acid to aid digestion and it basically served as a cure for rosacea for me.
I can understand some people finding the "herby" smell of 1st distill (or non re-distilled) peppermint to not be as pleasing as the "candy cane" smelling peppermint (like doTERRA's). However, that does not mean that it induces nausea. In fact, peppermint oils that have not been redistilled, or adulterated / changed by vacuuming are regularly used for nausea and digestive upset. See my post on Peppermint and nausea.
5. Moderating of Comments - Am I Just Censoring?
Pappas and his followers have commented numerous times that I am not approving his and other related comments.
Here is one quote from his Facebook page (which contains numerous postings which insult me):
In case anyone has been following the discussion over at The Whole New Mom blog there was a post from Adrienne directed to me that never did get answered. I actually did answer her questions but for some reason my answer was never approved to be public. Since there where people here waiting for my response I am posting it here how it should have read, in case anyone was wondering what my answer was.
and this:
Wonder why she is too afraid to let me post unmoderated and she let you right on through. This is just too weird. It feels like I am dealing with YOU KNOW WHO LOL
The "YOU KNOW WHO" that Pappas is referring to seems to be a large essential oil Direct Sales Company, or at least that's the best I can ascertain, based on his previous comments.
and this:
Thanks Syl [meaning Sylla Shephard Hangar, mentioned below] great to see you back into things as well. She had posted here, unmoderated I might add LOL
First of all, comments on Facebook, to my knowledge, can't be moderated once they are posted. They can only be deleted (or edited) by the admin of a page or edited or deleted by the person who posted them. So Facebook comments and blog comments are completely different things.
On my blog, I do have all comments moderated. I do that so that I can keep malware, blatant self-promoting, and foul language, etc. off of my blog.
When there are particularly intense comments, I take awhile to respond and yes, sometimes comments fall through the cracks. But I am not moderating them in order to censor people. To the contrary, I think that I approve many more negative comments than most bloggers. I enjoy the back and forth of ideas and think it's healthy to debate. Many bloggers consider negative comments to be from trolls and so they delete and and all - but I don't do that.
But I do not think verbal abuse and rude behavior is OK.
Many bloggers moderate comments and I have only once, in 2 years of blogging, had someone email me to ask why I hadn't approved their comment. In this case, Pappas private messaged me on Facebook several times, asking me why I wasn't approving his. (I have heard that now you need to pay to private message non-friends on Facebook, but I haven't verified this yet.)
However, one thing that really concerns me is his (and his followers') accusations on his Facebook page that I am not willing to get the truth out or that I have something to hide. To the contrary, that is why I held comments in moderation--because I wanted time to get to the bottom of things as best as I could before posting their information.
Some examples of what has been said about me:
By Pappas:
Wow, I guess this is what happens when people start fearing having other people around who know more than they do. Instead of wanting to learn more themselves they turn to protection mode so they can be the star of the show. Sad really. I tried to give her the benefit of the doubt, even defended her a couple of times. It is upsetting though when she directed questions specifically at me and I attempted to answer but she won't let me respond so people think I just chose to ignore her. Oh well, I have enough to keep me busy anyway. Thanks for trying.
I am not someone who fears having others with whom I disagree around. I thrive on learning and have been interviewing many companies in preparation for this series.
And I will do so again in a future series on Heavy Metal Toxicity.
Here is another comment by Ann McIntire Wooledge:
She has really started a stir and I guess that's what she planned on, but she is ultimately making herself look rather uninformed and UNeducated. The best thing she could do now is to just admit she doesn't even know what a chemical constituent is and much less how to decide where would be the best company to buy essential oils - and stop this stupidity.
and more (this by Pappas):
That blog site is the most confusing I have seen in a while. I cannot even see a link to Part 5, how the heck did you find it?
and yet another (by Sylla Sheppard-Hanger):
scrolled thru the nonsense of her facebook page to find
one more by "Cher Aromapothecare"
Excellent reply Dr. P. (The girl could use a class). I agree, CO2 (or perhaps florasols) would be maybe a little closer representation of a plant but even that's a stretch.
more (this by Pappas):
What really ticks me off about is that she makes some honest mistakes concerning essential oils in general that alot [sic] of people make, then I go on there and write an in depth post to clear some things up and she doesn't let it through. I don't know maybe I am taking this too personal. I really don't care who she concludes is the best oil company I only wanted to clear up misconceptions and general points. It reminds me of when I posted on some YL rep sites to get them good info only to be banned because the facts were not jiving with the programming from their messiah [sic].
and finally (again by Sylla Sheppard-Hanger)
all we can do is expose her and better yet the statements....its given me plenty of fodder for my new blog series!!!
Enough,eh? I frankly am really disgusted by this behavior.
I am really disappointed at the behavior and negative comments thrown my way throughout this and hope that they will stop.
6. About Me
Just to set the record straight, I don't typically post my "credentials," but in this case I think they are warranted.
I don't have an advanced degree, but the learning I have done since my undergraduate degree has been extensive.
Here is my background:
1. Top of my class in high school from a top level school.
2. Phi Beta Kappa from The University of Virginia, one of the top 15 schools in the country.
3. Echols Scholar at The University of Virginia. Admission to the Echols Scholar program is made based on "In brief, the Office of Admission looks for academic excellence, intellectual leadership, and evidence of the ability to grapple with complex topics." (Source). Apparently this group is representative of the top 2% of the University. Graduated with a 3.97 GPA.
4. Taught Equity Options Valuation at the Chicago Board of Trade to options traders and MBAs
5. Worked as a Manager in Employee Benefits
6. Independent Life, Health, and Disability Agent for 7+ years
7. Taught in Japan for one year and achieved near conversational fluency.
8. Research-minded mom of a child with life-threatening food allergies.
9. If I might jokingly add this, one of my local friends has called me the "investigative reporter" of health food and products. ;-).
Basically, what I am saying here is...I am not a genius, but I am not an intellectual slouch either. I don't mean this to discredit anyone else, but I am a deep thinker and am very concerned about excellence in research and learning and in conveying accurate information to you.
One final point. A few folks on Pappas' Facebook page have commented that I have removed links to Pappas' Facebook page and website. At first, I left all links left by Pappas and his followers, but I ended up going back through and deleting them because they were:
1. excessive and
2. resulted in basically blatant self-promoting.
Pappas doesn't allow advertising for oils companies on his page and I am choosing not to permit promotion of sites that deride my character in this manner. At the beginning of this matter, Pappas seemed to be congenial, but as you can see from the comments above, that has changed.
If Pappas' and his followers' behavior changes and I receive an apology that is not followed by more maligning, then I will consider allowing the links.
7. Troubling Questions
One thing that surprised me is that I think that the concerns I posted about Young Living were more controversial, and yet, to my knowledge, I haven't received any negative comments from any YL reps. When I signed up with doTERRA I heard from a lot of reps how negative and accusatory they felt the YL reps were.
Not in my experience.
Just to make it clear:
I am not saying that Robert Pappas doesn't have significant qualifications. He has extensive studies in the chemistry of oils and I don't. Clearly there must be a reason or reasons for the differing facts here, or at least there is a different way of looking at the industry.
- Is it because he is mainly a chemist and the former owner of The Perfumery?
- Is it because he worked for / was closely connected with doTERRA?
- Why does he concern himself so much about what "little old me" says when the owners of doTERRA contradict each other--and him--while speaking around the world, via meetings, videos and more, to audiences much bigger than mine?
- Why has he spilled so much electronic ink to challenge and insult me when none of the other oils companies that have been critiqued in my posts have expressed any concern?
I don't know. I am just trying to share what I am learning so that you can make a better decision about what essential oils you want to use for your family.
Which Essential Oil Did I End Up Choosing?
To find out which essential oil company I ended up with at the end of this search, read this post:
– Announcing “the Best” Essential Oils Company – Part 7
you can also read the other parts of the series here:
To see the other Best Essential Oils Posts:
- Which Essential Oils Company is Best? - Part 1
- Best Essential Oils -What a Good Oils Company Should Have - Part 2
- Which Essential Oils Company is Best - Troubles with the Oils Industry - Part 3
- Young Living vs. doTERRA - Part 4
- Are Multi-Level Marketing Oils Worth It? - Part 5
- Announcing "the Best" Essential Oils Company - Part 7
**ATTENTION!!!** - Some readers say that they can't access the Part 7. If that is a problem for you, please try refreshing the page once or twice. If that doesn't work, please comment or email me at wholenewmom{at} gmail {dot} com, and you can go to this post to get access to the company that I chose. Is Essential Oils Testing Reliable? I apologize and we are working hard to rectify the situation.**
(2) I didn't read through all the comments or search them, due to only a handful being displayed per page, so this may have already been mentioned, but I suspect Pappas' reasoning for mentiong that isovaleraldehyde is found in vomit is not to insinuate that just because it's found there it must be bad, and so its presence in oil is bad, but rather that it contributes to the smell of vomit and, due to its aroma, is not desired. Pubchem describes it as having an "apple-like odor," a "powerful penetrating, acrid odor," a "pungent odor," and a "weak suffocating odor" that "produces an irritating vapor." It also says it is "normally found in humans, particularly in the gut. The ACS states it "is a pungent liquid." So based on that, I don't find that statement by Pappas difficult to believe, though I do think that, if that's actually what he meant, he should have been more clear about it.
Hi again. The problem I have is that I don't see that it is in vomit. Can you find that information?
I didn't see anything specifically about that, but if it's in the gut, it's possible it would be in vomit. Ultimately, I don't think it's worth worrying about, since whether or not it's in vomit doesn't really matter. I was simply speculating on why it might have relevance and why he mentioned it. Even if something could be found stating that it's in vomit, that wouldn't do anything to answer the question of why it matters, whereas the info I did find about it regarding its apparently unpleasant odor does provide valid reasoning for removing it. As I mentioned, it would have been helpful if he had explained it more, but again, I don't think it really matters. I was just trying to provide some insight into what he might have been thinking. Sometimes when attacked we can get defensive and try to pick apart and disprove everything the other person says, and often it's just not worth it. I wouldn't get too hung up on the vomit aspect.
It doesn't appear to be in the gut. That was my point. I do think it matters due to the crux of his argument and how it fit into the whole conversation. I hope that helps. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Isovaleraldehyde
Did I attack him?
(1) I want to start by saying that while the intent of this post is largely to defend a couple of Pappas' statements, I am NOT defending him or his actions. I don't know the full story, and only you and him truly do. I will say that based on reading this series, and specifically this part, I can understand where both of you are coming from. From my perspective, I can't really blame him for being upset about the appearance of having his comments blocked. As you yourself have pointed out, many people do in fact do that, and I've had it done to me as I'm sure many people have. Even though you weren't blocking them for the reasons he thought, you admit you did block them, even if for what you thought was good reasoning (to allow yourself more time to look into them first). Personally, I think the better thing to do, both from a standpoint of allowing people to share knowledge and ideas and as far as not fueling the fire, would have been to simply allow his posts and immediately comment that you intend to do more research into them and follow up on them later. You may have known that the block was only temporary and that it was well-intentioned, but he (at least at first) didn't. And even once he did, I can understand the frustration of being silenced, even if only temporary. I'm not saying it excuses his behavior, but just offering my own view on it.
Hello Steve. Actually it's not blocking--I'm moderating them. I still actually have them in my dashboard and haven't figured out what to do with all of them. There are a bunch of other comments I have that are completely rude / things I need to research more / stolen content from my blog that I need to address, etc. It's a mishmash.
The reason that I didn't publish to follow up later is that I don't know how to keep track of comments that come in especially since I get a lot of them and it's much easier for me to keep them as I do now, albeit I'm way behind. Hope that helps!
I almost clarified when I said blocking but didn't, so I guess I should have. I chose that word specifically instead of moderating for a reason. The reason is that moderating is reviewing posts then deciding whether to allow them or not (i.e. block them). Since you didn't allow them, that means you blocked them. Please understand, I'm not trying to criticize or be a jerk, nor am I arguing semantics; I'm simply trying to help you see it from the other side, from a commenter's (Pappa's, in this case, though I don't want to presume to know what was going through his head specifically) perspective. You may have had every intent to allow them eventually, once you were ready to respond to them, but in the meantime you blocked them, preventing them from posting, which both gave him the impression you were really blocking them instead of temporarily moderating/blocking them and prevented him from being able to participate in the conversation. I rarely even bother to comment on sites that use Disqus anymore because I got tired of the moderation taking weeks to post my comments, at which point the conversation had died out. And one instance recently I posted on a site I fully expected to have my post blocked on (due to disagreeing with the site and all the commenters, not because of being rude or anything) and watched as posts submitted hours and even days after mine went up while mine was nowhere to be seen, until days later it finally appeared. So it can certainly be frustrating to even think it's happening. Again, I'm not trying to place blame or defend anyone, just hoping it helps you understand how your good intentions might have backfired. Moderation can certainly be a two-edged sword, as you're well aware.
I understand. I will tell you that most bloggers who get harassing or otherwise negative comments that they don't wish to deal with will just delete. I almost never do that. I'm just swamped and trying to be thorough and there is no way I could keep up with all the comments otherwise. I try to go thru when I have time. I literally have 56,000+ comments on my site. Most have a response from me--looking at the #s I have approved 33K+. I think that's pretty good and you can see how hard it would be for me to moderate them otherwise. I guess they might go in as approved by the date that they came in and I would have to go in and check them later but the amount of people who try to link drop and more is a big staggering at times (plus the spam filters aren't that great) so that's a problem. Thanks for commenting and I appreciate it--there is more to the story. Some things I can't share in public due to legal concerns.
What a delight to find your website and your investigative research about Essential oils. Your research is marvelous transparent and you write beautifully for ordinary readers.
Thank you !
I am saddened to learn how a few with financial interests have tried to disparage your work when it questions their source of income / loyalty.
I thought your attitude and the manner with how you handled it was near perfect.
While I've been attacked in similar vein (I've exposed environmental greed mongers) - I don't have any good advice, other than --
THREE CHEERS !!!
I am proud to cheerlead for someone willing to do the research on an important topic and present it in plain English.
Thank you so much! If you'd care to subscribe to updates I hope to revisit this in the near future and also have more posts on EOs coming out: https://wholenewmom.com/10-things-you-need-to-know-about-essential-oils-before-you-buy/
Is there any comparison against melaleuca essential oil series?
Hi there. What would you like to know? I didn't look at them that much b/c they have artificial fragrance and colors in quite a bit of their products.
I've been using DoTerra EOs for about 2 years now, with varying degrees of satisfaction. I am looking for another company when I came upon this blog.
I find the information presented here to be very revealing and eye-opening. This section 6 is almost unbearable, what with the drama and nonsense. It looks like Pappas is incredibly defensive, and while Adrienne makes no claims of expertise (seems she is simply reporting on what she has been told by EO specialists as well as read), Pappas IS supposed to be a professional in the EO industry.
He claims that no one in the industry performs second and third distillations, then Adrienne posts many excerpts from EO industry experts that soundly refute that notion. Then he continues to complain that Adrienne won't post all of his comments??? I wouldn't continue to allow that rubbish either! It kind of looks like Pappas needs a bigger sandbox... .
This is a good blog that points to the very real facts about abuses in the EO industry. One really HAS to do one's homework before settling on an EO company to purchase from.
One of the reasons I am getting away from DoTerra brand oils is because I think their quality has decreased over the time I have been using them, yet the price continues to climb. They are also VERY cryptic with their information; there are many contradictions in the information they offer.
Hi again, Jaye - I assume that you didn't think your comment went through--I just moderate everything. Can you tell me what you thought was cryptic? Just trying to get a handle on things. Also the contradictions. Feel free to email if you'd like. wholenewmom {at} gmail {dot} com. Thanks!
I've been using DoTerra EOs for about 2 years now, with varying degrees of satisfaction. I am looking for another company when I came upon this blog.
I find the information presented here to be very revealing and eye-opening. This section 6 is almost unbearable, what with the drama and nonsense. It looks like Pappas is incredibly defensive, and while Adrienne makes no claims of expertise (seems she is simply reporting on what she has been told by EO specialists as well as read), Pappas IS supposed to be a professional in the EO industry.
He claims that no one in the industry performs second and third distillations, then Adrienne posts many excerpts from EO industry experts that soundly refute that notion. Then he continues to complain that Adrienne won't post all of his comments??? I wouldn't continue to allow that rubbish either! It kind of looks like Pappas needs a bigger sandbox... .
This is a good blog that points to the very real facts about abuses in the EO industry. One really HAS to do one's homework before settling on an EO company to purchase from.
One of the reasons I am getting away from DoTerra brand oils is because I think their quality has decreased over the time I have been using them, yet the price continues to climb. They are also VERY cryptic with their information; there are many contradictions in the information they offer.
I'm looking forward to trying RMO oils. The ingredients list in their Immune Support blend is more well rounded than DoTerra's OnGuard; it has a lot more of what I am looking for in this type of blend.
Hello Jaye - thanks for reading.
As for the distillations, it's very very confusing. Seems to me that the terminology has different meanings to different people. However it was unfortunate that I was criticized so much when others are saying the same things.
I will have to look back at the old comments but I didn't post everything. I think I didn't post some when people were putting his vitae on my blog. I am sure he knows way more than I do about essential oils. I just didn't think it was the right way to act about it. Anyhow, it's a long time ago now.
There is, I'm sure, way more going on in the industry now as more and more companies are involved now. I hope to revisit this whole topic again soon so please do stay tuned!
I have thought essential oils are a bunch of nonsense for years, and just yesterday bought two from Young Living because of a friend who has gotten her anxiety under control with them (it looked her to also become a rep). We will see how it works for me.
She kept harping on the need to use a medical grade plastic diffuser because of the Young Living oils' purity and that all the cheap diffusers on Amazon are not medical grade plastic and that the oils could degrade the cheap plastic, causing the plastic chemicals to leach into the air.
Where do you recommend finding a medical grade plastic diffuser for a reasonable price? Also, is this a bunch of bunk? I really want a programmable diffuser that I can set to wake me up in the morning (I really struggle with waking up because of anxiety and depression), and I'm having a really hard time finding such a thing (and product descriptions don't say if a diffuser is medical grade etc.). Thanks.
Hi there and welcome. I asked about medical grade diffusers and heard that that isn't an accurate term. You just don't want low quality plastic. I think you would be fine with any of the diffusers that the company that I recommended offers and you won't be out a ton of money: https://wholenewmom.com/announcing-the-best-essential-oils-company-and-a-great-sale/
I disagree that all diffusers on Amazon are cheap plastic. Let me know if you need any additional help but there are diffusers with timers on that site and right now everything is 30% off for Black Friday Weekend! You can get a free bottle with any order over $49 too: https://wholenewmom.com/whole-new-mom-healthy-living-deals/
and here are more Black Friday Deals - there is some more information on the oils sale here: https://wholenewmom.com/healthy-black-friday-deals/
I appreciate the book suggestions. 🙂
You are welcome!!!
All I can say is wow!! I have enjoyed reading your posts! It’s very informative. You are entitled to your own option. I hate when companies bash each other. You never stated anything false that I could say and you didn’t get into all the drama between the two MLM companies. I’m shocked about how Dr. Pappas commented. Like you said (don’t know your exact word) why worry about “little old me”.
You’ve done so much research that helps people make their own decision. You don’t push the brand you use. It’s your opinion.
I’m with YL and that’s who I choose. I never state negative remarks about anyone and what brand they use. I like to educate people on getting chemical laden products out of their lives. If they choose to use the company I like great, if not that’s ok also. Anything is better than toxic chemicals.
Don’t let the haters get to you. You must be doing something right!
Thank you so much!!! Welcome! I really appreciate your comment and thoughtfulness.
Thanks for reading and commenting! Hope to see you around again!
Hi Adrienne,
I am currently in the market for some oils to upgrade from my Amazon starter pack ones. The more I research into new oils (mostly doTerra and YL) the more I come across "drama" and feuding between the two brands and the essential oil community in general. I am having a hard time trusting anyone which makes finding a brand difficult. I am also put off by the negativity in something that, essentially, is meant for wellness and to feel good. Do have any suggestions or insight on this?
Thank you
Hi there! The negativity is hard. That being said, there are problems with many companies (not just essential oil companies) so it's important to know the truth as well and sometimes there are some not so good things going on :).
What would you like insight and suggestions for? Happy to try to help. This is the company that I ended up going with: https://wholenewmom.com/health-concerns/natural-remedies/announcing-the-best-essential-oils-company-and-a-great-sale/
There is a free bottle oil with purchase on this page: https://wholenewmom.com/whole-new-mom-healthy-living-deals/
Hi Adrienne, I recently started using Peaceful Sleep from NOW and I was wondering if you know anything about there oils. I am thinking of buying a few other ones from them because my local health food store carries them and the oil seems to be working really well for me.
Hi there. I haven't looked at them in awhile but these are my updated purity standards. https://wholenewmom.com/health-concerns/pure-essential-oils-testing/
Hope that helps and glad you are enjoying the oils.
Are you familiar with Aromis essential oils? I have recently purchased one of their nebulizers (all wood and glass - no plastic, water or heat) and I was wondering if their oils are of similar quality as their nebulizers. I am currently using Ribbyrue essential oils (online retailer through ebay; can not find much information on them either). Thanks
Hi there. I wasn't until you mentioned it. I personally wouldn't buy from a company that I couldn't find much info on.
This post has my current purity guidelines: https://wholenewmom.com/health-concerns/pure-essential-oils-testing/
I hope to visit this again in the future but as you can imagine, everyone and their brother is getting into EOs so for me to evaluate every company would be an impossible task.
You can sign up here for updates if you like. Currently researching a lot about CBD, one particular essential oils and superfoods and glyphosate, etc.
https://wholenewmom.com/10-things-you-need-to-know-about-essential-oils-before-you-buy/
Thanks for reading
can you please send me the link for the essential oils company that you chose. I am not able to access it through the links on your blog. Thanks
Hi Robyn. Sure!
It's in this post where you see "Rocky Mountain Oils" - can you not see those? I would love it if you could tell me b/c if there is a problem I need to know about it. If those links aren't working can you tell me if you are on mobile/ desktop and iphone / android / chrome or another browser, please?
Thank you!
Adrienne,
I have read parts 1-6 of your blog on essential oils and have found it quite interesting, but when I try to access the last part, #7, it links me back to part 1. No part 7 to be found. I was on an Android phone this afternoon when I sent you the original message, and I am on an iPad this evening with the same result. Thanks for all your research I will definately look into Rocky Mountain Oils.
Oh my - sorry about that. Something is clearly not going well. You can get there from this post: https://wholenewmom.com/whole-new-mom-healthy-living-deals/
or this link: https://wholenewmom.com/RockyMountainOils
Please tell me if those work and thanks for the help regarding this problem. Much appreciated. We're working on figuring it out.
Hi again - could you tell me what browser you are using? Thanks again!
And also, are you just clicking and it's going nowhere? Thank you!
FYI Dr Pappas is no longer is testing doTerra's oils.
Yes, I heard that - that was a recent development, wasn't it?
Part 2 of 2
I have no reason to not believe everything disclosed here: https://www.youngliving.com/en_US/discover/the-young-living-difference. I also have no reason to believe there are no other companies that market quality oils.
(randomly found on FB, like I found this series of posts...randomly)
How much credence either deserves is debatable at best, but one certainly deserves as much credence as the next. So read this... https://essentialoils.org/news/eo_myths ref. Myth #8
{excerpt}
"... if you are using terms like "first pressing" then you've really got some catching up to do...
Most essential oils are steam distilled, in fact this is inherent to the very definition of an essential oil. The only oils that are considered to fall under the definition of the term "essential oil" and are not produced by steam distillation are the citrus oils, which are cold pressed from the citrus peel (and if its done properly there would not be any oil left in the peel for a second pressing)..."
Hi again. So you are saying that you think that everything on that page on YL's site is true, correct? I am not saying that it isn't, but can you tell me how they were caught exporting oils illegally then--if they are in control of everything from seed to seal, then how did that happen? Thanks in advance. I'm aware of the essential oils citation that you made. I have written more information about that in the blog posts and hope that has cleared things up. There is obviously a lot of confusion out there and I think what I have there is accurate. If you think it isn't please do point out your concern.
I started reading your posts...and going back to the REAL source to vet it...not just whoever you copied from, but the original SOURCE(S). I ran across the following on Facebook. I don't know the source, but let's face it I don't know you either. It is interesting that remarks by one person you don't trust that much to begin with were cited to discredit D. Gary Young (RIP) and those remarks were later removed by the sources you cited, yet you still mention them and say you can't cite them because they were removed. Shame! What I do know is if one is buying Essential Oils (even though they are labeled 1oo% pure) at cheap prices chances are they are adulterated with large amounts of synthetic linalool, synthetic linalyl acetate, "fragrance" (which could be anything), or other fillers that may be synthetic and toxic!! People are dupped all the time by "100% Essential Oil" on the label. All that may mean is there is a drop or two of pure essential oil mixed up with other fillers. I also know that YL oils (with the exception of the citrus oils...there may be others, but the vast majority) are not "pressed"; they are steam distilled. Going back ages and ages people twist the stories to try and sell what they believe in and it's sickening how one will try to disparage another in order to make their product seem the best. A product should stand on its own merits and not on having to disparage the other guy to make itself look better, but it is done regularly! GO TO THE SOURCE. FIND A COMPANY YOU TRUST. STOP TRYING TO INFLUENCE PEOPLE BASED UPON RESEARCH THAT IS NOT VETTED ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE ORIGINAL SOURCE. (Part 1 of 2)
Hi there. What post are you referring to where I said I couldn't cite something any longer? What original source are you saying we should go back to? I assume you like Young Living. Are you saying that they are the best original source?
All the outside negative comments to your blog that you have quoted here sound like a campaign to discredit you by the companies that would actually be discredited by your investigating. And you can't do anything about them. I support honesty and the search for truth. Keep on doing what you're doing.
Thank you!!
Hi Adrienne. Wow, this is an eye opener for me. Thanks for your post. I am just a person newly looking into essential oils trying to find the best for me at a good price. I have heard of Dr. Papas, but truthfully, I can't figure out what he's trying to say about the essential oils. Maybe I'm not educated enough :). (I am being funny, in case someone doesn't get that part). I definitely think he and others went the wrong way trying to make you look as though you had no idea what you were talking about. I have learned a little, but it is such a big world out there regarding EO's, it's hard to get the right info about companies and their oils to make an educated decision. It would have been nice if he had tried to educate more than just belittle you. His information would help a lot of other people, too. Now, I'm not sure I have any reason to read what he has to say after the way he treated you, and the information you shared. I have found a few companies I like and will just keep trucking and reading real blogs like yours. Your articles, opinions, or whatever anyone wants to call them, really help me a lot. Again, thank you for taking the time.
God bless you and your family. I do not know how you have time to do much else besides taking care of your family.
Thank you so much, Donna. Well, the whole thing was very frustrating. I had information from a source, then later amended it, but I wish it could have been more amicable. Bless you as well....the blog has become a family affair and my kids are older now. I am getting help from others too--you will see some new writers here soon. I can't do it all :).
I stumbled across this series of yours while looking for your Adrenal Fatigue Blend. I thank you for ALL your many hours of research (so I don't have to). 🙂 I appreciate your straight forwardness in your responses to those critics. I learned A LOT from you in these past 20 minutes. I recently went back to YL after having to stop due to a financial difficulty, but am now going to look into the RMO's. And I'm greatly intrigued regarding the NYR Organic's, and plan to look into them too. Thank you Thank you Thank you and please keep up the good work!
You are so welcome. Thank YOU for the encouraging words. I've shared this on other posts but it's been a rough number of months and I've been doing TONS of research into other products and companies and I'm worn out! I have been looking at other companies as well--but will have to revisit. Feel free to email me. Blessings!
Are the oils from bulk apothecary as good as Young Living & Do Terra?
Hi Kaye - that's a tough question. I don't know but I don't use any of them. I mentioned this to you in response to your other comment but these are the guidelines that I recommend to determine if an essential oil company is one that I want to trust or not: https://wholenewmom.com/health-concerns/pure-essential-oils-testing/